EPISODE SUMMARY
In a world where sustainability is often framed as “doing less harm”, Paul Hawken argues that this is not enough. A pioneering voice in environmentalism and regeneration, Paul believes that businesses and societies must shift from mere sustainability to actively creating more life.
In this episode, Paul challenges conventional climate narratives, explaining why carbon is not the enemy but rather the foundation of life itself. He explores the deep interconnections between the biosphere and atmosphere, the limits of technology-driven solutions, and how indigenous knowledge holds vital lessons for regeneration.
Paul also critiques the corporate approach to sustainability, advocating instead for a systemic shift where businesses integrate biology into their core strategies. He calls for a fundamental transformation in how we view the world—not as a collection of separate crises but as an interconnected, living system.
Join us for a provocative conversation on rethinking business, reimagining our relationship with the planet, and moving beyond sustainability toward true regeneration.
What do we talk about?
00:00 Introduction and Paul Hawken’s Background
03:15 Paul’s Early Environmental Awakening
07:40 The Evolution of Climate Change Awareness
12:05 Why the Current Climate Narrative is Failing
17:30 Carbon as a Flow, Not a Culprit
22:10 The Deep Interconnection Between Biosphere & Atmosphere
27:50 Why Indigenous Knowledge Holds the Key to Regeneration
33:20 Rethinking Business: Regeneration vs. Sustainability
38:45 The Role of Corporations in Restoring Life on Earth
44:15 The Problem with Technology-Driven Solutions
50:00 Why Climate and Social Justice Are Inseparable
55:30 A Call for a New Mindset: From Extraction to Reciprocity
61:00 Final Thoughts and Vision for Change
Impact
Paul Hawken has been a transformative force in reshaping our understanding of climate, business, and regeneration. As the founder of Project Drawdown, he has pioneered solutions-focused approaches to addressing climate change, shifting the conversation from fear-based narratives to practical, scalable pathways for reducing carbon emissions and restoring ecosystems.
His groundbreaking work—including books like The Ecology of Commerce, Natural Capitalism, Drawdown, and Regeneration—has influenced business leaders, policymakers, and environmental activists worldwide. By challenging conventional economic and corporate models, Hawken advocates for a regenerative approach—one where businesses and societies don’t just do less harm but actively restore and enhance life on Earth.
Beyond climate science, Hawken’s philosophy integrates indigenous wisdom, ecological interconnectedness, and social justice, emphasizing that climate, biodiversity, and human well-being are inseparable. His latest book, Carbon: The Book of Life, seeks to reframe the way we perceive carbon—not as a pollutant, but as the very foundation of life itself.
Through his writing, research, and public speaking, Hawken continues to challenge corporate sustainability strategies and push for a systemic shift in how humanity interacts with the planet.
“After 40, 50 years, less than 1% of the world is engaged in climate action actively. That means it’s a failed narrative. The narrative is about fear and reduction and loss… People don’t gravitate toward restriction and warning. They move toward possibility.”
“We’re still using words like ‘fighting climate change’ or ‘tackling global warming.’ These aggressive, war-like metaphors make nature seem like an opponent. That’s not how we solve this crisis.”
Environmentalist, Founder of Project Drawdown, Regenerative Systems Expert, Bestselling Author
“Reboot Business” podcast host Julian Devaureix interviews Otto Scharmer, a senior lecturer at MIT and creator of Theory U, about navigating the current radical transformation of the business world due to social, energy, and environmental demands. Scharmer discusses systems thinking as a way to understand interconnected global crises like ecological damage, socioeconomic inequality, and mental health issues, emphasizing that these are symptoms of deeper disconnects.
💡 Is our obsession with economic growth leading us to collapse?
Economist and research Gaya Herrington joins us to discuss why GDP is a flawed metric, how degrowth can lead to a thriving well-being economy, and why businesses must prioritize resilience over efficiency. Tune in for a critical conversation on reshaping our economic future.
Dennis Meadows explores the consequences of humanity’s pursuit of infinite growth in a finite world and the urgent need to shift our focus from sustainability to resilience.
The discussion dives into the challenges of systemic change, including the societal and political resistance to acknowledging physical and planetary boundaries. Drawing from decades of research and observation, Meadows shares insights on adapting to a post-growth economy, fostering resilience at individual and community levels, and rethinking long-term goals in the face of ecological and societal constraints.
